Posts by Island Man

245

Still pointing your Finger when having a Rafter in your eye?

by DocHouse in

yes- everyone has faults and makes mistakes; an organization even more so.. yet, you ignore all the fingers pointing at you.. many here have no faith.

many here go to churches who lie about everything biblical; look at x-mas!.

but at least we know god and christ and try to live up to their name!.

Island Man

DocHouse, did you say "Churchianity"? You don't sound like a JW. A JW would say "Christendom". You sound like a member of the Assemblies of Yahweh.

263

Poster country flags and privacy

by Simon in

the new forum originally had a little country flag next to each post showing the country that the post was made from based on the geoip encoding (the country the ip address is from).

before i switched over to the new site someone made an issue about it violating their privacy and i didn't want to complicate and confuse the switchover with policy debate at the same time as technical issues so removed the flags even though i disagreed.. someone has already requested it as a feature and i think it should be added back so i thought it's now time to open the discussion and get everyone's opinions.

first, the reason i think it should be shown:.

Island Man

Simon, I take your point that revealing a person's country, on its own, is insufficient to identify someone, especially if it's a relatively large country with a "hay stack" number of JWs.

But if other details are known about a poster, then knowing their country could just become the last critical piece of the puzzle to identify them.

You must also keep in mind that this is especially true of some of us who live in very small countries where there are very few JWs thus making it not too difficult to identify an anonymous poster if their country is known.

I have no problem with a feature like a spinning globe with little points anonymously representing the location of each poster. That would give a nice feel of the international scope of the ex-JW community posting on here without individual poster identity of each point on the globe.

Your point about us being responsible by not giving out too much information is taken. But you must appreciate the fact that posters on here would have determined, in the past, just how much information they can share and how much is too much, within the context that their country of origin/location is anonymous. An awake JW may have determined in the past that revealing X, Y and Z about themselves is perfectly safe because no one knows what country they're in. Is it fair to come now and retroactively invalidate that poster's past assessment of the security of his anonymity by now revealing his nationality and thus putting his anonymity at risk when it was not at risk in the past?

30

Site issues: Jan 02 Update (Sign In)

by Simon in

i've deployed a fix for people affected by sign-in issues caused by having multiple accounts associated with the same email address.

here's how to activate the fix:.

you must attempt to sign in using the email address associated with your account (not a username) and must have access to that mailbox.. if there are multiple accounts associated with the email address then you will be shown a warning message with the option to have an email sent to repair your account.. the email will contain a link to a page showing all the accounts associated with the same email address and allow you to select the one you want to be active (it will disassociate all the other accounts from the email address).. once you have completed the process then you should be able to sign in as normal.

Island Man

I was having an issue where whenever I signed in using my email address I would have to keep signing in to the site again the next time I open my browser even though I checked the option to stay signed in.

Then when I signed in using my user name - Island Man - I noticed that I remain signed in when I reopen my browser. So I think the feature to keep you signed in works with user names but not email addresses. Either that or Simon fixed it at the same time that I signed in with my user name causing me to think that was the solution.

31

Does anyone have the 2014 stats from the 2015 Yearbook yet?

by berrygerry in

does anyone have the 2014 stats from the 2015 yearbook yet?.

(isn't it usually out by now - or are they waiting to celebrate new year's day?

).

Island Man

I think the discrepancy between the percentage increase and less baptisms could also be partly due to disfellowshipped JWs being reinstated. The hype about 2014 being 100 years since the birth of the kingdom could have scared some indoctrinated DF'd JWs into returning. They would add to the increase in publishers without showing up as new baptisms.

13

What do Jehovah's Witnesses look like to Non-Cult members

by Watchtower-Free in

.

Island Man

That ain't Tony. That's Lett. Watchtower-Free, that has got to be the funniest JW meme I've ever seen! ROFLOL :laughing:

15

Why I HATE the WTS

by berrygerry in

as a baby-boomer, i went through the pre-1975 bs without giving it any credence.. even as a youngster, my mind said: "if jesus said that no man knows the day or hour, then why the h is everyone saying that a is coming in oct.

" and i left as a teen.. for whatever insane reason, i was convinced to return a number of years later, and sadly, got dunked.. major faux pas.. in previous posts, i have mentioned my endearing love of great rock (god bless rock and roll), esp.

my teen faves bto, etc.. attending this concert ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yukhsmphvvo ) and watching fred turner's fingers drive me crazy, as one of my children has music in his soul and the fingers of a protege.. i hate that this cult destroys the orgasmic satisfaction that comes from the giving and receiving of pleasure from each others' developed or natural talents or gifts.. god bless rock and roll.. .

Island Man

I've often wondered about this myself. How many "greats" has WT crushed by depriving a person the opportunity to gift the world with their talents?

Thank God they didn't succeed in crushing Michael Jackson's talent!

12

Wisdom in "the Word of God". Really? What Watchtower got wrong at this week's Congregation "Bible" Study.

by Island Man in

the congregation "bible" study (cbs) for the week of december 29, 2014 to january 4, 2015 was taken from draw close to jehovah, pages 179-182, paragraphs 1-8.. paragraph 3 seems to be using the ancient jew's fear of jehovah's thunderous voice to justify the wisdom of him using moses to record and transmit his laws to the people.

but there is an implied false dichotomy here.

since god is supposedly almighty he is most certainly capable of giving a personal revelation of his requirements to every human in a clear, concise and unambiguous manner that they can fully understand and remember - without having to use his thunderous voice.

Island Man

Thanks for the comments all. I especially appreciate the point about the low levels of literacy in bible times. This is something that Watchtower appears to be in denial about.

12

Wisdom in "the Word of God". Really? What Watchtower got wrong at this week's Congregation "Bible" Study.

by Island Man in

the congregation "bible" study (cbs) for the week of december 29, 2014 to january 4, 2015 was taken from draw close to jehovah, pages 179-182, paragraphs 1-8.. paragraph 3 seems to be using the ancient jew's fear of jehovah's thunderous voice to justify the wisdom of him using moses to record and transmit his laws to the people.

but there is an implied false dichotomy here.

since god is supposedly almighty he is most certainly capable of giving a personal revelation of his requirements to every human in a clear, concise and unambiguous manner that they can fully understand and remember - without having to use his thunderous voice.

Island Man

The Congregation "Bible" Study (CBS) for the week of December 29, 2014 to January 4, 2015 was taken from Draw Close To Jehovah, pages 179-182, paragraphs 1-8.

Paragraph 3 seems to be using the ancient Jew's fear of Jehovah's thunderous voice to justify the wisdom of him using Moses to record and transmit his laws to the people. But there is an implied false dichotomy here. Since God is supposedly Almighty he is most certainly capable of giving a personal revelation of his requirements to every human in a clear, concise and unambiguous manner that they can fully understand and remember - without having to use his thunderous voice. Such a "holy download" into the brain of every human would not only ensure that all know and understand God's requirements but would also, by its very nature, provide convincing evidence of it's divine source since each human can see that the message he received perfectly correlates with that received by others and yet is communicated is different words to suit the knowledge, understanding and unique background of each individual.

There would also be little cause for doubting the accuracy and divine authorship of the message as happens when it is conveyed to a few humans who in turn write it down so that it can be copied from generation to generation, leaving later generations in the position of having to trust the claim of human tradition which says it is the handed down written word of God.

Paragraph 4 makes the point about how writing the law down solved the issue of the difficulty of having to remember so many laws. But isn't that exactly what rank and file Israelites living in Moses' day had to do? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it true that the Law was only readily available to the priests who were charged with orally instructing the rest of the nation? Regular Israelites didn't have the luxury of consulting their own personal copy of the Law like bible owners today have.

Mention is made too about the inaccuracy of conveying the message orally from generation to generation. This point is valid but the personal revelation method I mentioned above addresses this issue better than creating a written record in ancient Hebrew which then has to be translated in myriads of future languages, many of which do not have the vocabulary to exactly convey the message as it is in the native ancient Hebrew. In other words, having to translate also introduces errors, or more accurately, it obscures or waters down the message. A personal Revelation tailor made to each individual who is born at all times in history, solves such problems perfectly.

Paragraphs 7 and 8 talk about the wisdom of God using human writers. It mentions the great knowledge and wisdom of angels then turns around and says the angels would not have been able to convey God's message to humans in the best way for us to appreciate it. What a contradiction! In actuality it would have been better for angels to have been used. Why? Angels have greater insight into God's true nature than any human can. Also, given that angels have the opportunity to observe humans for many centuries, they would be able to sift out the truly timeless and universal human qualities from those that are specific to one particular culture living at one particular time. Thus they would be able to convey God's message in a manner that would be understandable to all humans living at all times. By contrast, having the bible written by humans living in ancient Palestine, results in the creation of a book filled with archaic language and cultural references that are not only difficult to understand and translate to other future cultures of humans, but are also often offensive to them.

So a better job most certainly could have been done. While recording the bible is better than relying on oral tradition, it is certainly not the most wise option that one would expect from an all wise God, given that this particular method also has serious issues. God giving a clear personal revelation to each individual living at all times is most certainly a much better option that removes a lot of the issue that comes with a once for all time written record made thousands of years ago in archaic language with archaic cultural references that future generations find hard to translate, understand and stomach.

62

Your explanation for a total contradiction in the New World Translation.

by Johnny Brown in

"for if you publicly declare with your mouth that jesus is lord,+ and exercise faith in your heart that god raised him up from the dead, you will be saved.

10 for with the heart one exercises faith for righteousness, but with the mouth one makes public declaration+ for salvation.

11 for the scripture says: no one who rests his faith on him will be disappointed.+

Island Man

"It is certainly true that JWs do not view Jesus in the same way as early christians. . . .
However it is a mistake to go to the other extreme and try to read the trinity back into the text. The trinity is a post-biblical attempt to reconcile monotheism with worship of Jesus."

Amen to that! The bible does not teach a trinity, but does clearly show that Jesus has a very high positioned and should be honored greater than the JWs are honoring him. Trinitarians and JWs have extreme opposing viewpoints of the nature of Jesus that is inconsistent with what the bible says of him. The Jesus of the bible is somewhere in the middle. First century christians did not believe in a trinity, but they definitely esteemed Jesus more than JWs do.

62

Your explanation for a total contradiction in the New World Translation.

by Johnny Brown in

"for if you publicly declare with your mouth that jesus is lord,+ and exercise faith in your heart that god raised him up from the dead, you will be saved.

10 for with the heart one exercises faith for righteousness, but with the mouth one makes public declaration+ for salvation.

11 for the scripture says: no one who rests his faith on him will be disappointed.+

Island Man

I have a serious issue with the NWT's insertion of "Jehovah" in the NT when there isn't a single Greek NT manuscripts containing the name of God. The insertion of "Jehovah" into the NT of the NWT has corrupted some NT texts. Romans 14:8 is a notable example of this, where the NWT erroneously renders "kyrios" (Lord) as "Jehovah" even though the very next verse (Romans 14:9) makes it clear that the "kyrios" of Romans 14:8 refers to Jesus and not Jehovah.

However, even though I don't agree with the NWT replacing "kyrios" with "Jehovah" at Romans 10:13, the fact is that that particular "kyrios" does in fact refer to "Jehovah" (YHWH). I say this because Romans 10:13 is quoting an OT text - Joel 2:32 - that uses YHWH. It might be tempting, from a Trinitarian standpoint, to use Romans 10:13 to suggest that Jesus is Jehovah given that Romans 10:9-11 speak about the importance of faith in Jesus.

But Romans 10:13 is only being used to bolster a point made in Romans 10:12 and the point being made at Romans 10:12 is the impartiality of God. Romans 10:13 was quoted by the writer as an OT example of God's impartiality because it says EVERYONE who calls on God's name will be saved. It's simply not an attempt on the part of the writer to suggest that YHWH of the OT is the same Jesus of the NT.

Having said that, it is also possible that the writer of Romans 10:13 considers calling on the name of Jesus to be tantamount to calling on the name of Jehovah and therefore in fulfillment of Joel 2:32 - all without intending to suggest that Jehovah is Jesus. How so? Think about it: Jesus means "YHWH is salvation" and Joel 2:32 says people will be saved by calling on the name of YHWH. The name Jesus embodies in one word the message of Joel 2:32. Jesus is YHWH's provision for salvation. By calling on the name Jesus in faith, one is putting faith in YHWH's provision of salvation and is therefore putting faith in YHWH. He is quite literally saying: "YHWH is salvation". So calling on the name of Jesus is really calling on the name of Jehovah by proxy, as it were. So it is very possible and very reasonable for the writer to apply Joel 2:32 to calling on the name of Jesus in faith without believing or intending to suggest that Jesus is Jehovah.